AGK Panel: What and Where is “The Blaze” in Fenn’s Treasure Poem? 2018 03 14


good evening ladies and gentlemen this
is Toby Younis of a Gypsys kiss thanks for joining us tonight stick with us for
a couple of seconds and we’ll introduce you to the world’s top Fenn treasure
searcher ms Cynthia Meachum I don’t know about the top but one of them and we’re back
good evening ladies and gentlemen of the panel how are you all doing tonight very
well good all right let me quickly make introductions for our folks in the
chatroom first of all tonight we have Shelley
Carney who is my partner in a gypsies kiss Mike Cowling of the cow lazarre’s
YouTube channel my special guest tonight is my daughter Toby Rene Younis who’s
who’s volunteered to stand in for producer tonight and of course we have
miss miss Cynthia Meachum but I’m gonna let each one of them introduce
themselves in turn Shelley wanted to go first
well hello I’m Shelley Carney with a gypsy’s kiss I also have my own YouTube
channel called the softer side which you can find by typing into your browser www
the softer side dot me and on that channel I do relationship coaching for
men and please check that out and subscribe anything else you want to know
Toby will tell you Mike hi everybody I’m Mike Cowling I’ve also got a YouTube
channel under Cow LAzar’s I did a bunch of lots called Forrest Fenn said what I
invite everybody to go over and check those out and also we talked about other
treasure hunts so thanks for having me Mike do me a favor Mike and turn your
volume down just a little bit again tomorrow I popped up just a tad
Toby Renee wanted to tell everybody about yourself and how we’re related I
guess I don’t know hi everyone I’m Toby Renee Toby Younis’ youngest daughter
no YouTube channel but I enjoy watching everybody else’s well thank you thank
you for joining for us and last but not least our guest for the night miss
Cynthia Meachum hi good evening so I’m Cynthia and I live here in Rio
Rancho and I’ve been searching for Fenn’s treasure for a very long time and
I have absolutely no idea where it is so I’m not sure why Toby
wanted me on this show but maybe we’ll figure it out tonight so there we go we
hope so we will try to to make it a good show for everyone tonight
we look forward to having a good evening what I’d like to do before we we get
started is I have a short clip that I produced from the Nightline video that
was played on is it ABC or CBS ABC back in January and Cynthia this is one of
the many appearances on various media that Cynthia’s made it was kind of fun
so I’m gonna play that when we come back we’ll talk more with Cynthia Tonight deadly treasure it’s the Thrill of the Chase adventurers scouring the Rocky Mountains for a chest said to be filled with millions in riches oh my god I see bronze hidden by an eccentric antiques dealer their only guide a cryptic poem Begin it where warm waters halt and take it in the canyon down for a legendary supposedly hidden treasure worth millions to whoever finds
it first let’s go this way oh my god I see bronze Dale Neitzel and
Cynthia Meachum are among perhaps thousands looking for this bronze chest
how many trips have both of you made trying to crack this one it’s somewhere
in excess of 65 different trips I’ve made over 100 trips but this time Dale
and Cynthia are convinced the first clue begin it where warm waters halt
leads to the Yellowstone National Park area known for steaming hot geysers and
pools we’re going to start where warm waters halt and for us that’s Madison
Junction and I really believe it’s at a place that has sentimental value to him
in September Dale and Cynthia each drove hundreds of miles to check out their
latest hunch inviting Nightline along so when you find the treasure how are you
gonna divide it up are we talking thirds ease here how about your crew exclude them nevermind okay fifths where have you brought us this
morning this is grayling Creek so into the
wilderness we go looking for something the poem calls a blaze if you’ve been
wise and found the blaze look quickly down your quest to cease I don’t know
what a blaze is neither do we so I think it has to be something something in the terrain
yeah white rock or a big white stone or a cliff or maybe even a mound of rocks
but just a few minutes later to me that’s the blaze they say they’ve found
it look quickly down your quest to cease but tarry scant with marvel gaze just
take the chest and go in peace so does that mean it means get your butt over
there and start looking quickly down off that rock blaze and find the hidey spot all
right as we venture deeper into the wild we’re not alone there’s a dead animal a bear in the
neighborhood who brought the bear spray I do have some bear spray the potential
for danger bears included is real and recently
people have been literally dying to find Fenn’s treasure very nice I love that
scene where you find the dead deer in the bush and Dale turns around and
asks anybody if they brought the bear spray with them so before we get started
with our Q&A tonight I wanted to say hi to our moderators Joel Lewicki man in
the barn and Jimmy fast thank you gentlemen for your help and support in
all of this we’re glad that you’re here this evening to keep our chat room
moving along nicely so Cynthia since we kind of finished in that in that
particular well well first I didn’t give you a chance to introduce yourself and
talk a little bit about your new blog one of the reasons
that we asked you to be here tonight is because you’ve just established a brand
new blog why don’t you tell everyone a little bit about it where they can find
it in kind of what your objectives are in establishing that blog well I decided
to finally start a blog because I I needed a place where I could actually
advertise my book and at the same time I decided that every now and then it’s
like the my brain doesn’t stop as I’m sure lots of you experienced in it I
just felt like I needed the right and I didn’t really think anyone would ever
read it it was just a it was just something I decided to start and
whenever I had a thought and something to write down I just thought well you
know I’ll just write an article for me and if anybody reads it fine and if not
that’s okay too but the other thing I wanted to do with this blog was I needed
to have a place where I could keep where I could organize some of my stuff I mean
I have documents all over my computer and and just like in the media and some
of the pictures and whatever so I really just was also using it as a way to
organize and also I have a few relatives who live far away from me you are also
interested in Fenn’s treasure search and this also gives them an opportunity
where they can just you know log in and read whatever I have to say that day or
a couple days later so it was a way to keep in touch with them as well oh thank
you for that well since I was going to say we ended the clip from Nightline
with you with you and Dale and the host from the Nightline episode talking
about the blaze and we promised our panel I’m sorry our audience tonight
that we’d spend some time talking about it so let’s hear it from you what what
should our searchers be looking for when it comes to the blaze well I don’t
really know but what we can do is we can use some of the things that Fenn has
said in interviews or like when mysterious writings or whatever over the
past five or six or seven years and one of the things that he has said is
that it is something that stands out it’s one of the other things and I have
notes here so I so I don’t get things wrong so wanted one of these that I
thought was really good and this was from Margie Goldsmith in an article that
she wrote for United hemispheres back in January of 2014 so we’re looking at over
four years ago and that was an first ones that that brought national
recognition to the search right right and and what I found so good about this
specific one is Fenn well now this is a printed this is in print so we just have
to assume that whatever Margie put in quotation marks is actually what Fenn
said to her but assuming that this is correct
Fenn says what does the word blaze in the poem mean a horse can have a blaze
on its forehead a blaze can be scraped on a tree to mark one’s way a blaze can
mean a flame or a scar on a rock so I I think you know when you look at all
those things it’s mostly some kind of a mark or a I think it’s going to be
something fairly small that is on a larger feature or formation or a boulder
or or whatever but that I mean none of us really know until the treasure is
found we won’t know right but one of the things I like to look for when I
searched and what Dale and I actually saw when we were with ABC was often the
distance we actually could see that rock face and that rock face really did stand
out from the time once we exited our vehicles and and we went down over the
bank and we went through the trees and then came out into the meadow I mean
that was like oh my god I mean not that really was a surprise I did not know
that was going to be there so that to me some I mean it stood out so it’s like
okay now we need to get to the the base of
that and then you know and see what might be there but for myself I wouldn’t
I like when I can see like any kind of a white streak like a mineral deposit in
boulders or cliff or something that definitely
stands out I think that’s perfectly reasonable Shelley
your opinions on the place well again I think we don’t know until we come upon
it and I do think it is geologic so that it will last for a long time and of
course been said that you you couldn’t remove it it wasn’t practical to try to
think about removing it so I think it has to be pretty large then we’ll
probably the only way to remove it would be with dynamite or some mining of some
sort so I think it is what Cynthia said with the white mark mountain geological
what did we say a white kind of a granite looking thing that’s as best as
I can okay Mike your opinion we shall we touched on it a little bit what the
first question I have when I think of the blaze is did Forrest then create it
for the poem for one of the clues or is it a geologic feature in his special
place and I’d look at it both ways I think it’s possible he could have
created it but it would have to be something permanent or semi-permanent he
could have taken a hammer and chisel it possibly carved something in a rock face
or a canyon wall and as we’re going along we see it we look quickly down I
take the poem at face value when it says look quickly now if you’ve been wise
have found the blaze so I think the treasure chest is located right below
the blaze and I try I struggle with is it something that he created or is it
just a feature that he’s using that was already there in this place and I think
it could be either way but I think it’s something smaller um I’ve heard some of
the solutions people think the blaze is as big as a football field and you’ve
got to look all over for it I think it actually marks where the treasure chest
awaits for us fine so I’m gonna steal a little bit from each of you because I
have I think it’s four opinions on what the blaze has the potential to be first
of all I agree with Shelley and Cynthia that there’s some geologic component and
that it stands out in the same way that a that a streak of white quartz
stand out against a granite mountain rock I think that’s the first
possibility I’ll agree with Mike in that I think the second possibility is that
it’s something petroglyph or petroglyph or pictograph like that Fenn
may have placed himself to identify this space the third is that it’s it’s you
know straight out of the Osborn Russell survey that we talked about in
yesterday’s episode actually the traditional definition of the term blaze
and that is something cut into a tree but of course it doesn’t have the
longevity that something that’s you know that’s geologic in nature but maybe that
was his intent maybe he wanted to be a temporary blaze for the people that were
living now but later on would make it more difficult for the people that were
searching for the treasure and then the fourth thing that I do a lot of research
in is based on that streak of light that appears at certain times of the years in
in Chaco Canyon to identify the beginning of the summer solstice and the
and the winter solstice I believe that’s how it does and it’s a it’s a cleavage
in the rock that enables the Sun to cast light on afar facing cliff but it only
happens a couple of times of year so one of the things that I’m exploring is the
possibility that perhaps the blaze may have some astronomical component
associated with it you know so that it’s associated with a the sun’s placement in
the sky at the at a certain time of the year in relationship to you know
another set of stone objects which would have permanency and which wouldn’t
change over our lifetime necessarily so okay well good those are all good
Toby Renee your hand is up you’ve got some questions for us few questions and
I guess we’re going back to the beginning yeah that’s okay yeah the true
you’re moving Yellowstone to search why do you believe it’s there not New
Mexico who was that from that was from Jimmy fast okay Cynthia you want to take
that sure while Jimmy I’m not actually moving to Yellowstone I have heard other
people say that but what I told the Fenn last fall and I was really serious about
it is I’m going to take my camper to West Yellowstone for the summer and I
told him I’m not coming home without the treasure now I think part of your
question is why do I think it’s there I don’t I don’t necessarily think it’s in
West Yellowstone or Yellowstone National Park or maybe the Gallatin National
Forest I don’t know but somewhere up in maybe that Montana
area Yellowstone or down even into parts of Wyoming but I just need to be a lot
closer to that area so that you know I’m not 900 miles away or whatever it is
from here to there so that that really is my intent to spend as much time up
there and may june july august as needed how much time have you spent up there
already if you don’t mind me asking about three days when I was there with
Dale and abc it was a very it was a very short trip and the weather was horrible
I I didn’t see the clip that you guys watched I don’t know if you could tell
that was freezing my butt off but unfortunately we were there what the
second or third week in September and there was actually a snow storm that
came through and it was snowy so it was quite cold then so I that was the only
time I was there and I didn’t get to do is near as much searching
we’re just hiking around as I had hope but I’ll tell you what that was my first
time ever to Yellowstone and I fell in love with it and even if the treasure
isn’t there it I know everybody gets so sticky here in this and I get so sick of
even saying this when I do the media but it is so about getting out there and
seeing other things whether or not you find the treasure at least for me that
that’s just huge so it’s a win-win for me
I can’t wait to go back and I’m just waiting for the snow to melt
well Yellowstone is consumed one of the gems of the National Park
System Shelley before we go back to the chat room did you have a question for
Cynthia I do have a couple of questions let me ask this what resources do you
use to formulate your search solutions that you feel provide most insights
well definitely uh-oh all the maps I mean I’ve had I’ve been searched New
Mexico basically for the first four and a half years and I spent hundreds of
dollars on every on every map that covered northern New Mexico
I mean forest maps I mean like Santa Fe National Forest and then Clarkson
National Forest and and every Force Mac and then there’s other other independent
map makers and so I would also get to get their map so I mean I had I probably
had close to six or ten maps just of northern New Mexico just like when I was
13 in the enchanted circle I I probably had three different ones that are really
really used for that now now that I’m searching in Yellowstone especially over
the winter I used Google Earth Pro all the time and I mean I’m virtually
searched a lot there and I have a few maps on my walls which if I turn my
camera I would to show you my maps but then you’ll see the X or you might have
mark but anyway I am a map person I’ve always loved maps and a combination of
maps the thrill of the chase I’m I’m gonna quit going down the rabbit holes
and using scrapbooks or whatever I’m just going to get back to the thrill of
the chase the poem Maps and Google Earth and maybe I’ll get lucky mm-hmm
Toby ranae your hand is up you got another question for us we’re just
hearing some feedback regarding volume levels for several different people
Shelly I think you’re a little bit quieter sighs Ellie I think there’s a
way to turn your volume up on your phone because that’s as close as you’re gonna
get Shelley is softly spoken anyway so and
the only the only control I have here is for
everyone I can only do everyone or no one that’s that’s how it is
so Toby Rene did you say you don’t have any active questions right now no active
question all right Mike let’s go to you do you have any questions for Cynthia
you touched on the scrapbooks and I was just wondering are you in
communication with Forrest Fenn when you go search because I know a lot of the
searchers think that when he comes out with something that he’s answering their
solution that they sent to him or he’s trying to give them a message and I was
just wondering is anything that he’s posted you think was aimed at you or one
of your searches no I wish but no I actually don’t think that he
communicates to me I know there are people that think that and it’s like all
right I don’t know I don’t think he goes with me and and if he is then I’m well
I’m not getting that because I haven’t found it so I don’t think so
although I will add one quick thing so last what when was it like February
March or April he then published like oh my god how many scrapbooks in just a
short period of time so in one in two of those scrapbooks one of the times he
actually used the name Meacham it was a ladies an author’s name from long ago
and and it was brief but it was in the story and then had another couple
scrapbooks he said since the end well I’ll tell you what that got my attention
and I said that to do someone else that I communicate with through emails and he
said well in that case he said my name I don’t know how many times because his
first name is his last name were somewhat common and this idea I know
you’re right it’s it’s just coincidence so no I I really don’t think he does
very nice so well we’re well we have a break in chat room questions can you
update us on I know you’re not directly involved in it but I know you’re kind of
tracking it at least I think you are can you tell us about fenberry 2018
the only thing that I know is what is posted on David Rice’s fenberry email
its fenberry org so if you want to go there and see what he has on there there
there is a woman that I think her name is Connie someone I don’t think I know
her unless she goes by a different name on the blog’s but she has not reached
out to me so I do not I do not know who she is all I know that is if you go to
thon buri org they actually did honey reserved the Hyde Park shelter to I
believe for a I think it’s a Thursday Friday Saturday Sunday possibly and it
is June I’m thinking that might be the weekend like June 12 or something or
something in there anyway for anybody that’s interested you can go to fenberry
org and the dates are there and I don’t think there’s hardly any other
information I I don’t know how she communicates with other searchers if she
uses a Facebook page I’m not sure and then the only other thing I have to add
to that is I’m putting together a group gathering in West Yellowstone June I
believe its 22nd and 23rd it’s a Friday and a Saturday it’s not going to be
anything big it’ll be just for whoever’s in that area and it’s been suggested
that whoever can has a campsite whether it’s me or somebody else everybody in
the area that wants to come over and have a campfire and sit around and tell
stories will do that and there again you can you can get the details to that on
Dale’s blog it’s under 2018 meetups and then Montana and and the only other
thing I have to say about the thing in West Yellowstone is they’re the reason
that weekend was chosen was because there is a guy who is actually writing a
book and he I mean it’s real he has a publisher and everything dan barber EC
is his name he interviewed a lot of people at last year’s fenberry
and he has the go-ahead to write a book on the fence searchers and he will be in
West Yellowstone part of that week and if there’s anybody that wants to talk to
him I’m sure he would love to hear more stories from other searcher so anyway if
anybody’s going to be in the West Yellowstone area
I think it’s June I don’t even know now ah
but you can it’s the third week in June and you can get the actual dates on
Dale’s website do me a favor Cynthia is your microphone on your
headset cable yes do me a favor and just hold it up it’s right there you don’t
have to hold it that high but just hold it up it’s hitting something on your
neck and so it’s knocking a crackling noise when I when you’re talking so if
you’ll just hold it like that for us that’s that’s perfect right there so
when you lower it against something it’s rubbing against a patch just making tell
me now I talk with my hands I know I know I know
tell me ranae your hand is up you have a question for us yeah except you’re on
mute Toby Renee thank you why rule out Santa
Cruz lake that you explored and are you and Dale going to continue any more
searching together would you put any agreements forth for splitting the
treasure before you go no Dale and I I hope we actually get to meet up in
Yellowstone sometime this summer I his schedules much more difficult for him to
get away I’m retired so I can just go whenever I want to
I know Dale and I have never talked about if we find it together what
happens and there again it’s not like we officially teamed up to do this and then
the other question was what I’m sorry why did you rule out Santa Cruz Lake Oh
because I looked there about 15 times then I couldn’t find it but I loved that
place and I I thought I actually had a good solution to that and I I mean I I
went the whole way around the lake the part that I couldn’t actually walk down
to the bank where where the santa cruz river came into the
lake which is actually what I thought fence special spot was I couldn’t never
walk there so I finally kayak over to it and I mean
there was some really really neat cutout in the rocks I mean that was big that he
could have died in but there he there was just no access to it so I know I
wrote it out and I moved or you know it’s that area up there especially going
up the river and up towards the Falls it’s a difficult hike and it requires
some adventuresome Ness to be able to do that Shelley did you have another
question for Cynthia at what point did you feel most sure that you have the
correct solution in what area were you searching and what made you feel that
way actually the one time that I almost had a heart attack because I was so sure
that it was going to be there it wasn’t a Santa Cruz Lake area it was up on top
one of the mesas where it was really nice and flat and the view is great it
was not difficult to get to and there was a large flat rock in amongst other
boulders that so seemed out of place and I was sure and that was my parry scan so
I was sure that I was going to flip that big flat rock up and find the chest not
not to where you had to dig but to where it would have been recessed into like a
small Basin in the ground under that slab of rock and I was actually so
confident and this is funny now because this is years ago and it’s like I was so
wrong anyway I even took my time doing it because I
was so sure it was gonna be there and I put my fingers underneath that rock and
it was very heavy so I had to just tilt it up on edge to see underneath it and
there was just more rock underneath it so I was wrong
so since you have noticed that in several of the videos that I’ve seen you
searching whether you produce the michelle’s yourself or they
produced by someone else that your dog is always along with you I don’t know
if it’s male or female but I was going to ask what kind of help does your dog
provide you yeah ma I originally when I started I had two y Me’s and Emma had
passed away in 2015 but Molly still goes with me all the time
and Molly generally she doesn’t run away or anything she’s older so she’s often
off leash and she can just go do whatever but one of the funniest things
was when I was doing one of the media’s I can’t remember which one it was and
the cameraman was shooting footage of us walking and all of a sudden I can’t
remember if it was a rock or what I saw in this I go let’s go look at this and I
tilted the rock up and Molly just started digging like a crazy dog and he
actually thought I had her trained to do that
that was just coincidence but it made it made it pretty cool but it was never
used in the footage very nice Mike got a question yes if you always thought that
what warm waters halt was the first clue before the radio interview was posted
that Forrest said it was the first clue have you used the first stanza to come
up with a local above the location search I always thought where warm
waters hope was the first clue so you know I’ve always thought it was a warm
spring or a hot spring and then I I mean I have been to every spring in northern
New Mexico so then it’s like okay this has to be wrong so then I started to
come up with other things and and early on before some of the later Fenn quotes
I actually did use I used the Vietnam Veterans War Memorial over in the Angel
Fire area and not just me others have used that too but so I thought warm
waters help could be tears and the fact that that was I think it was built and
that the timing fit perfectly for when Finn moved to Santa Fe and everything so
I thought yeah it really could be that and a metaphor but since he came out
with the quote about you know to fill where there’s many
places in the Rocky Mountains where warm waters halt and nearly all of them are
north of Santa Fe so then it’s like okay I don’t think it’s a metaphor anymore I
really do believe its water so I’ll tell you I just I have a hard time looking
using anything other than a spring for my warm waters a warm spring an opal oh
god yeah they’re like a spring yes although so there’s a lot of places in
New Mexico especially on the lower part of the Red River which I have searched a
lot where the Red River is famous in New Mexico for fishermen in the wintertime
because of all the springs that flow into the edge of the lower part of the
Red River and you can actually walk out along there and see all this green
almost like little lily pads or algae or whatever and that water is not really
it’s not cold but it’s not warm but so I thought of spring I mean if the spring
comes out of the ground you know that water never freezes I’m not sure about
the word warm that phen used you know I do think it’s related to temperature and
I do love the idea of the the actual warm to the touch waters when I can find
them which is one reason I want to go to yellow the Yellowstone areas because I’m
sort of out of warm waters halting here in new Memphis and there’s plenty of
options when you go to Yellowstone Toby ranae you got a question for us I do
this one actually goes to the panel who’s it from well did you did you go
past it yeah I did but I’ll ask it first and find that one but do you share for
us hunch that it may be found this summer Cynthia why don’t you take that
on you expressed an opinion on it earlier today I don’t know I think he’s
just trying to motivate in everybody there are so many people that really do
think that that’s directed at them which is a cool thing I mean I could say the
same thing forest is the master of marketing
and making everybody or a lot of people think that they’re going to be the one
so I I really thought it was gonna be found last year and it wasn’t and I
don’t mean by me either I mean just by someone and it wasn’t so I don’t know
it’s hard to say Mike what do you think when you when you heard him say that I
just thought he made the comment because of the sheer number of searchers that
are on the chase now but I’ve heard we’ve I’ve heard it bandied about
300,000 I don’t know if that came directly from forest or not but maybe
just because the number has increased so much that that’s why he thinks maybe
it’ll be found this summer and Shelley what did you think when you heard it Oh something that we yeah we always feel
like he’s talking to us so I wanted to remind everybody that if you wanted to
raise your question in the chat window and give it more visibility if you use
the super chat feature down at the bottom of the window you’ll see a dollar
sign you can use the super chat feature which will highlight your question for
you and make a contribution to our cause which is to share all this information
with the community and it inspires us to continue working hard you know to share
information like this so Mike did you have another question for did I get to
you do you have another question for Cynthia I just had in general I guess
for everybody it’s an idea I want to see what everybody thinks of as far as the
blaze we know Forrest Fenn had his bronze
bells he had a foundry he knows about molten metals what if he actually
created the blaze and figured out a way to put bronze on the face of a rock or
on a canyon wall so that when the Sun would actually glint off it I mean if
anybody is on a search and you see bronze inscribed in some kind of a shape
or mosaic on a wall I think we would all know exactly what we were that it was
related to Forrest Fenn so I don’t know how he would be able to do that but I
thought it would think it’s an interesting idea
so are you suggesting let me make sure I understand what you’re suggesting are
you suggesting that he heated metal at some point and and then that that heated
metal that bronze that he brought with him he poured into a blaze like object
at the location or he cast something that that he then placed at the location
well I don’t know how he would heat it at the actual location and actually pour
it in I mean that would be a great idea if he could figure out how to do it
didn’t he say he told him he couldn’t create his bells a certain way and he
figured out a way to do it yeah it was the it was actually the the jars that
the threading or lit jars yeah so I think that’d be a great idea if he’s
able to figure out a way to do it that but if the blaze is actually made of
bronze and the Sun would definitely reflect off of it that would be a
perfect blaze how he was would be able to accomplish that I don’t know I’m an
email him and see if he answer yeah I haven’t had that’s the first time I’ve
heard anything like that what do you think about that Cynthia oh I love that
idea I don’t see how he legit eclis could have done it but if he could have
somehow done this from home and then taking it there and then mounted it to
to the feature or the formation I like that idea
that’s a very interesting idea is that what do you think she’ll yeah it would
Toby ranae do you have a question for us from Cindy yes
she says describe what you have thought to be home this is to Cynthia
describe what you have thought to be a home of brown in New Mexico and where
have you searched a new myth New Mexico specifically and why have you ruled it
out so let me let me just qualify that you don’t have to give away all your
secrets but we’d love to hear your thoughts on these matters well over the
years I’ve used everything for a home of brown just because you know I like it to
sound somewhat like a viable solution once I had a I mean the whole thing is
the start if you don’t have a valid warm waters hope yeah I mean even if it’s not
the right thing but you’ve got to have something to start with so once I got
that and of course there’s almost always a canyon anywhere in the mountains then
the next thing it’s a Homer Brown and I hate to say I’ve used some really
ridiculous things I’ve used a an area at the convergence of the Rio Grande and I
think it’s the Rio de Taos where there is a herd of bighorn sheep but live
there so I used the Sheep as Homer Brown that particular area and well early on
god I even hate to bring this up I don’t even want to bring this up so it was
that bad I’m not gonna go to yeah the cabin yeah I did use structures early on
and then you know stopped using structures so to me that is the most
difficult clue of all to figure out what the heck he means or I mean I really
have no idea and the only other thing I can think of is and I and I think I
talked about this in my book a little bit it’s I think it’s going to be a a
place for sure I mean a particular place and maybe it’s going to be where at one
time there was a I don’t know a ranch or something that was named Brown which is
no longer there anymore but it still may be considered Browns whatever if you’re
familiar with the area and in the analogy I used and my book was baby’s
cabin up in the Pecos so and I’ve been told so so I was I read a book and I
thought baby’s cabin was no longer there but but it’s on the map you can look on
the Pecos national force and you can see up its mark baby’s cabin so I hiked
towards that area but never went actually as far as that mark was where
the cabin one time stood and I thought it was no longer there that there’s no
structures what so over there someone told me in an email
that they thought it had been rebuilt or or at least there was something else in
that area where there is a structure but to me I don’t care the fact that it was
baby’s cabin at one time baby’s cabin is for sure not there anymore whether or
not there’s been another building built close by but that place when the map
were it originally was is called ladies cabin on the map so I think maybe home a
brown I don’t know I’m sure many of us have gone back and we’ve gotten maps
from back in the early 1900s when Forrest was younger and if you look at
some of these you can actually find a place that was called Browns something
or other and then that name changed I think even maybe by 1930 or by the time
fen even started going up there it had been given a different name but but it
was called Browns something earlier so maybe something like that I don’t know
by the way I did want to I wanted to mention it make a comment on something
that you said earlier your obsession with maps I have the same obsession I
spend fortunes on maps of areas that we’re searching in I start there happens
to be a BLM office near just south of Santa Fe and I can’t tell you and they
know me by first name literally yeah because I go in there and buy whatever
maps I can and then stop at places in Taos and do the same thing so Toby ranae
do you have a question for us I do from Joe Lee wiki again do you have plans to
search in Yellowstone or do you plan to search outside the park I hope to do
both I so you know there’s so many places where our warm waters is
everybody else hang on Cynthia just to hang on just a second place I don’t mean
interrupt is everybody else picking up that little chattering that’s happening
I can’t figure out what it is I might be fidgeting yeah just hold that
microphone still because I think that’s where it’s coming from
so I’m sorry so we’re around Yellowstone do you plan to search
so so the question was am I going to search both inside the parking outside
the park boundaries and the answer is yes there are even inside the park even
if I really find it hard to believe that he hid it in the park I mean how would
originally he planned to die where he was where he hid the chest so I don’t
see how he could not have to hike too far in and die there and not have the
Park Service find his remains so that that’s one reason I find it hard to
believe that originally he picked a place that was in the park but with that
being said there’s also a lot of good starting points of warm water in the
park that you can actually fit quite a few of the clues in and it’s places I
want to see anyway oh and of course Ojo Caliente and back to fairy Falls and
Sentinel Sentinel meadows I think it is that’s one area I don’t care if the
treasure is there or not I’m gonna go see it for me and then there’s also a
lot of places around West Yellowstone the Gallatin Madison County that I hope
to narrow it down and that will be my main search area where do you plan to
where do you plan to live well while you’re there I actually have
reservations at a KOA campground oh just outside of West Yellowstone very nice
Toby Renee more questions you’re on mute yes everyone seems to love old maps like
you guys do but the question that keeps coming up by numerous people they’re
saying didn’t Porter say it isn’t it is possible but not feasible to remove the
blaze he did say it’s possible it’s correct he not feasible but he qualified
it and I thought it was different from feasible if it was it was as if he was
saying it is possible but it would require a tremendous amount of effort I
can’t remember the exact quote but I left with the impression after hearing
or reading what he had said was that Shelley go
do you have it uh yeah elder elder brooder reno i can’t say his name but he
says here is the exact quote while it’s not hot
well it’s not impossible to remove the blaze isn’t feasible to try that’s the
sense that I got in the implication to me was that it was some geologic device
that you know some geologic component that you would have to bring in a
blasting crew to remove it if you if you thought you needed to how did you
interpret that Cynthia yeah I agree with the sand I agree dynamite can pretty
much remove anything it’s not feasible and not impossible but I just yeah I I
agree I have a question for calles ARS if I may ask go ahead please feel free
so so Mike you talked about one of the ideas you have about the blaze is it
being a petroglyph is that because of fence statement when he was asked that I
had the quote right here this was one mysterious writings I believe in 2014
someone said is the blaze one single object and fens reply was in a word yes
so does that have anything to do with you pic and petroglyphs because for me
you know if you have the word petroglyphs the word yes is actually in
that that have you considered that that quote is not why I thought of
petroglyphs but the what I was trying to think more of is why is this place
special to Forrest Fenn why is he considered this his special place and it
may be because of the geologic feature that’s there like a petroglyph maybe he
has found a location that as far as he knows nobody else has been there and it
has a petroglyph in it and that might be the reason he thinks it’s his location
and why he wanted to go there with the treasure chest and spend his final
moments there Shelley any more questions for Cynthia I do have one more and I
think it kind of fits in with what some of the other people wanted to know is
so Cynthia do you feel you’ve done your due diligence and searching in New
Mexico and have eliminated all possibilities that the treasure is
hidden in that state I have a limit I have eliminated all the known
possibilities to me I am not telling other people not to keep searching there
because I I have no idea really which state it is in
I just cannot come up with any more really valid warm-water places I have I
think like I mentioned earlier tonight I have been to every warm water spring
that I could find that’s north of Santa Fe and and I have come up with some
half-decent solutions and I’ve searched it and not just me my god tons of people
have searched the ones all along the Rio Grande and of course last summer then
forests came out and said it’s not along the Rio Grande which heel emanates them
anyway but even in the hemas mountains there’s a lot and that’s around the vias
caldera there’s a lot so those are still valid areas I just I’m just done there I
I just can’t come up with any other solutions to use those as my starting
points to keep searching there Mike any last questions for Cynthia before we
start wrapping up do you have clues lined up in the Yellowstone area we are
going to go the summer do you have a where warm water salts are you’re going
to kind of go up there and figure it out when you get up there no I I have a
couple right now that and they’re not inside Yellowstone
National Park and they just list those alphabetically for me I would appreciate
it you know when it comes right down to it I really don’t think any of us and I
don’t care if you’ve been searching if you’re totally new to this tonight or if
you’ve been looking for eight years I don’t think that you can find this if
you don’t solve the poll so that’s what I’ve been trying to do this winter and I
have spent more time this year listening to the interviews from from early on
like 2011 those are the best one when it seemed like force actually gave
out better information we’re so listen I’ve listened I mean I
it’s crazy I’ve spent hours listening to the videos and then my god just like
many of you I practically have the thrill of the chase book memorized so a
combination of just those the interviews and the book and just and the Maps and
Google Earth and I just I’ve spent so much time just trying to solve the poem
that I think that’s the only way any of us have a chance so a chatroom I wanted
you guys to know that I’m gonna start wrapping up here in just a few minutes
so if you have any questions for Cynthia or Mike or Shelly or me this would be a
good time to get them in because once we start wrapping up we just close up and
you know you won’t get a chance after that until the next time we do one of
these and we plan another guest for you so Mike all your questions are asked
yeah I’m real quick I just wanted to say that Gary and the chat said he was from
Destin Florida I visited Destin Florida when I was a teenager I have an uncle
that lives in Destin Florida and he is the master of ceremonies for the Destin
fishing rodeo that happens every year and October so anybody in Destin say hi
to Bruce Chiefs tell them ah his nephew Mike says okay Shelly anything else I
just wanted to say that if you have asked a question in the chat and we
missed it Toby will be going back to answer any for HEK of the panel and I
know Cynthia had planned to go back as well an answer in her blog is that
correct Cynthia that is correct yep I will go I will watch this the show
after it’s on YouTube and I actually can see the chat questions there that’s
right and so if there’s if there’s anything that was directed at me that I
have not answered I will try to get them on my blog in by I don’t know the end of
the week what day is this so it’s Wednesday so in a few days
well good where can people find your blog okay it’s WWJ seen Fenn’s treasure
calm no apostrophe and fens and all those
faces all one words chasing Fenn’s treasure calm yes okay so
that’s a good idea we’ll do as Charlie said we’ll do the same thing we’ll
answer any questions that we missed Toby Renee you have a question for us we
did have a couple more that came in after you notify that we’re closing up
but one of them was what was her blog so you answered that one Cindy gasps asks
if you felt any closer Cynthia to finding it
absolutely not I have no idea where it is I’m serious
I don’t know and I guess this is a longer one so I don’t know if you can
answer this now but why wouldn’t warm water halts near B Colorado border since
New Mexico is where warm waters are they should stop in Colorado you know let me
let me take that one that’s a very that’s a comment oops hold on a second
I’ve got a I’ve got a batch of corned beef and cabbage on and it just started
boiling over so you guys handle that for me for just a second so Cynthia I was
just wondering do you ever get frustrated you know you’ve been on a lot
of searches did you ever get frustrated and want to give up or at least take a
break for a while no not really the only thing that I really got tired
of was when I searched Red River so so much and it was about a three to
three-and-a-half hour drive to my house Red River which which traveling north in
the morning was no problem but when I would come home in the evenings I’d
always get stuck and not five o’clock bernalillo traffic and it got to the
point where I wouldn’t even go out on a Friday because it was so bad or or I
just made plans that it’s going to be a really really long day and I will but I
will stop and I’ll either eat in Red River house or whatever because I cannot
hit bernalillo at like 5 o’clock so that was the only thing that I really found
frustrating because there was a time when I was going almost every day or
every other day when I was doing the boston acres area
and that that got to me the traffic yeah it’s difficult when you come back down I
mean it’s beautiful as we make a drive very similar to yours
and it’s very nice on the way back but if you hit if you hit that Bernalillo to
Albuquerque traffic at the wrong time it’s it’s just a mess it takes you
forever to where the truck is just is right yeah right we’re right where the
treasure chest is hold on I’m getting kind of a signal that says OBS is
disconnecting and I’m not sure what that means I don’t know whether we’re gonna
lose a signal here or not um so let me see is there anything else
Toby before we go thank you Matt it is I love one of my favorite dishes is corned
beef and cabbage so I look forward to st. Patrick’s Day every year just so I
can make a batch and kind of enjoy it for a week long Shelly Shelly I was
gonna say Shelly Renee Shelly you have a you have a question we did not give that
answer and when you get up to do cooking about the border at Colorado so if you
wanted to finish that okay let me see who asked that let me go back to it
because it’s it’s one of those questions it’s a it’s not really a AGK why
wouldn’t warm waters all be near Colorado border since New Mexico is
where warm waters are they would stop in Colorado that’s not really a question
it’s more of a hypothesis and and you can formulate almost any hypothesis the
simple fact of the matter is it’s correct to believe that that warm waters
do start in New Mexico on any of the borders but primarily the Colorado
border so for example in the primary example of that is on the Rio Grande
which we all know the treasure is not but on the Rio Grande the warm water
salt at the Colorado border because the specialty trout waters on the Rio Grande
began at the Colorado border and go all the way down to the Taos Junction bridge
so it is possible but it’s a hypothesis that stretches the definition and you
have to believe in addition to that you have to believe in the Toby Eunice New
Mexico Department of the Game and Fish definition of warm water salting so I I
don’t I think a it’s a hypothesis and B I’m not sure it’s a relevant hypothesis
anything else Toby really no I think that’s it okay wrap up time Mike why
don’t you go first tell us about your blog tell us about your treasure hunts
before we close up yeah cause ours is the YouTube channel cause ours grand
adventure is actually over with we’ve got our six winners but Charles
yeah thanks we had a lot of fun with that there were 16 puzzles total and
people whip through them pretty quick so we have our six the books are already
ordered they pick six different turns you’re hunting books but tomorrow on my
channel I’m going to upload the vlog where all the participants we had 67
players I’m gonna randomly pick one and they’ll be able to order any book they
want so that’ll be uploaded tomorrow I invite everybody to check it out and I’m
also gonna release the puzzles publicly one at a time so everybody can see get
an idea of what the grand adventure is about and you can decide maybe you want
to participate in very nice Shelley why don’t you do a close out mention your
YouTube channel and what are the plans for the rest of the week for a Gypsys
kiss all right so in a Gypsys kids hunt
tomorrow Thursday at one o’clock mountain Daylight Time though right
right mountain Daylight Time day like one o’clock we’ll have book club we’ll
be discussing chapter six my spanish toy factory a lot of you were interested in
that yesterday so we let you know that’s going to talked about tomorrow we have a
wonderful analysis of that along with the bottle of love block seven young
walk from New Zealand so very exciting Friday we’ll have another episode of
just the facts just the FA cubes and Toby and I will actually be answering
that question in conversation so that’s going to be fun and that’s all we have
coming up to the Vista this week and then next week of course we have the
same is this week it’ll be all over again so make sure you join us again and
tell us about your YouTube channel alright my youtube channel is called the
softer side it’s the softer side is relationship
coaching for men you can get to my channel by typing into your browser www
dot the softer side got me Emmie and that will take you directly there please
check videos subscribe great relationship
advice it’s really good for anybody who’s interested in a relationship or in
a relationship not specifically men but it’s really great for men as well
so please check that out and I have new videos that come out every Thursday and
then I have fun little ones on Tuesday that I put out on Instagram at least
what’s the topic for your tomorrow’s video tomorrow’s video is it’s called We
Need to Talk that kind of a conversation called computational or emotional hmm
one of the advantages I have is I get to shoot these videos that Shelly posts
through her YouTube channel so I’ve gotten to learn a great deal just by
listening to the scripts that she’s writing I’m I’m actually becoming a much
better relationship person as a result although I’m not sure my daughter’s
would agree tobe Renee you want to say your good nights and goodbyes and we’ll
see you next week right good night from the east coasts and I’ll see you next
week and what are you how are you coming along on your plans to do the triathlon
it’s going great three more months oh yes so you’re still training pretty hard
for it oh yeah very nice well yeah so training right now uh and then of course
we’ll be out to visit you guys in April I think is the dates I sent the dates to
Ryan so I’ll see you that third weekend in April yeah all right
and Cynthia tell us about your blog where people remind people where they
can find your blog and what’s your short terms plant plans are and also when are
you planning to make your move to the Yellowstone area so to start to answer
the first question my blog again is at chasing Fenn’s treasure calm so I try to
write a few articles per week and I try to keep them fairly short and there are
areas after the articles where you actually can write comments and then
when I’m going up to the Yellowstone area I hope that
my reservations are for the end of May but I’m definitely going to start
watching the weather here come April and even if I can’t start doing a search I
just want to get really familiar with the area and one thing I’d like to add
for me to leave New Mexico after four and a half years it is really hard
because I feel like I know every square inch of northern New Mexico and now I’m
starting off out in a totally new area to me so I mean I I just need to get go
up there as soon as the roads are decent enough and the weather is decent enough
that I can just even drive around just to get my bearings and catch up to all
you smarter people who have been looking up there for eight years so anyway yeah
I hope this make my first trip up there maybe in April well thank you for
joining us tonight your conversation was great it was very informative and I’d
like to tell everybody in the chatroom that Mike cowling won’t be joining us
next week we were going to be missing both Mike and Shawn because they have
other commitments so I’ve invited Cynthia to join us on the panel next
week and we haven’t decided upon a guest but Cynthia will be part of the panel
next week and interviewing the guest whatever guests we select so we’re happy
to have her back for that in another way for those of you in the chat thanks for
joining us tonight don’t forget that live chat replay is now a feature on our
channel so you’ll be able to see the chat along with the video once the video
has been processed by YouTube that takes about two hours so thanks for joining us
this evening thanks for asking the questions that you did there were really
good questions Toby Renae thank you for handling that for us and we’ll see you
next week for that Cynthia have a good evening Mike Shelly thank you for
joining us Shelly of course I’ll see you tomorrow for our program tomorrow for
the rest of you thanks for joining us tonight we hope you enjoyed it we hope
you invented an informative we look forward to seeing you at 1:00 p.m.
tomorrow for our Forrest Fenn memoirs book club and then we hope to see you
next week of it with a and pinned a big another panel and a
brand-new guest okay thanks for joining us and have a good evening you

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