Conversations with Great Authors – Upton Bell

good day welcome to conversations with great authors I'm John Harrison co-editor with Kim nayi of Dead in good company a celebration of Mount Auburn cemetery today we're here with Upton Bell author of present at the creation and he's going to tell us about his storied career in football and broadcasting on radio and TV on interviewing and about his famous mother and father Francis Upton the Broadway star and Burt Bell the Commissioner of football and owner of the Philadelphia Eagles Upton welcome to conversations of great thank you John it's a pleasure to be here not in dead company but in good company I'm still alive right here it's a pleasure to be here as pleasure to have you here thank you it is so you've got 50,000 questions so let's start whatever you want well let's start with your father of course with Bert Bell owner of the Philadelphia Eagles and the Commissioner of football and the father of the NFL as we know it today let's start with that well you know it's really interesting a lot of people don't know that that Bert Bell actually was one of the best high school athletes in Philadelphia and in fact many people thought he was a baseball prospect big-league prospect more than a football prospect he went he eventually went to will he went two or three prep schools always just bailing getting out the door to run the other one but he end up going to University of Pennsylvania and the interesting thing was the Philadelphia I think it was wasn't called The Enquirer then had a quote front-page quote headline when a John C Bell his father who was the Attorney General of Pennsylvania second in command on the Walter Camp Rules Committee a trustee at Pennsylvania was asked where is young Bert Bell going headline Bert Bell will go to Penn or he will go to hell that was the headline is still around today so he end up going to Penn and becoming their quarterback who eventually to the first pass in Rose Bowl history in 1917 when the Ivy League and Penn and Harvard and teams like that were the powers in America and actually his story of throwing that first forward pass against Oregon a hundred years later they came back to honor him and I was down there for that but he was a quarterback there he was one of the leading punters and drop kickers at the time drop-kicking was as we saw when Doug Flutie attempted to do it here with the Patriots was a big thing he could score from any angle but the other thing is about his life a lot of people don't know is that in his junior year he was elected captain they played on Thanksgiving Day against Cornell which was a traditional game at that time right after the game was over he and most of the football team and many of the athletes at Penn walked down to the depot and registered for the draft they joined the army they fought across Europe one of his best friends who people might not remember but I'll refresh their memory in that group was Jack John B Kelly Grace Kelly the famous actress Princess of Monaco his father they were lifelong friends they fought their way across Europe in the end Bert Bell was honored by General George or General Pershing for valor in the field came back to Penn finished his senior year and then went on to coach throughout the the Ivy League at Penn and temple and places like that so he had he had a career all before that that nothing do in fact where was story written by Kevin Paul DuPont in the Boston papers about three or four years ago his father was wonderful to his people in Philadelphia owned hotels the ritz-carlton still has a mansion which I wish I had that's on the National I start register and Rittenhouse Square but one time he got in a fight with one of the players from Dartmouth and they were playing then the next year and he said if we lose the game he owned the Stutz Bearcat which was the car he said if we lose that damn game he said I will leave the keys in the car and the car is yours they lost the game the guy went to the parking lot of course today he couldn't get away with it and drove the car away there are more stories about him before he became famous as the founder of the Eagles the Pittsburgh Steelers and the first person and the Pro Football Hall of Fame that he wants he was one of the best golfers amateur golfers in America so one time he was drinking out at a country club outside of Philadelphia and this guy said you know like your nose you know so so damn good he said I'm gonna bet you I think it was like $5,000 then won $5,000 he said I can beat you and my father said to him I'll tell you what I'm gonna blindfold myself and play you the last nine holes and put the $5,000 up in cash he played the last nine holes blindfolded and won the bet that was think about that I mean it's hard to believe he wasn't pulling it down the TV or anything he was just one of those great fabulous characters that in the ante coached for John Heisman Heisman Trophy but the turning point and we're going to get into some of the things about my mother a little bit later on the turning point was he was a playboy up to the age of 39 he knew everybody knew Al Capone it's in those days gangsters and and and people from all walks of life all kind of hung together they went to Saratoga racetrack in New York they all knew each other unlike today what do you happen to do that down yeah unlike today when you can meet some idiot on Twitter then you really had to know these people so actually he met my mother at a party and she had become a quite a store which we'll get to later on in Broadway she at the time was engaged to the famous financier son but our group but our brute was Franklin Roosevelt's chief financial man she was Catholic he was Jewish in the end it didn't work out she broke off the engagement I mean she could have had the wonderful very very rich life instead of marrying some poor bum who's trying to keep his team going they met at a party in New York Axl Lindbergh was at the party and he asked her he said you know I'd like to really go out with you honey and she said nobody calls me honey number one she said number two I don't date drunks so it shows up six months later his father owned the ritz-carlton but the ritz-carlton roof in those days in between plays the different actresses and actors played the roof and all these famous hotels have made a lot of money so she happened to end up playing the ritz-carlton roof in Philadelphia and he was running out at that time and he said hey honey how about coming down to my place I want to show you my some of the outfits I have she said I'm not interested in seeing any outfit you have for those other women you sleep with so that that that was it she said again he said I'd really like to go out yeah I don't go out with people who drink so a year later in Atlantic City he calls her long-distance she was in Chicago doing a play with Ruth etting who will also get to later and he said it if you marry me I promise I'll never drink another day in my life and he said all my drunken friends are here to hear the story and she said okay I'll give you a year and from that day on he never had a drink the rest of his life he had an iron will they got married secretly Walter Winchell who would be CNN today announced the secret marriage that she came back to Philadelphia they get married on the church steps they walked down the Bankruptcy Court he bought out the Philadelphia Frankford Yellowjackets which was almost like a semi-pro team and they're walking back to their hotel and he sees the National Recovery hack Franklin Delano Roosevelt he said that's the name of the team so that's how they get started their honeymoon and there are pictures that I found today their honeymoon was in Atlantic City they rented a house and the football team went with them now your mother was very influential in direction your father went in football wasn't she I mean yeah she well that's that's correct in those days the the the college football is what the NFL is today people look down and on pro football you know pro football you have the Bears and you have eventually the Redskins and you had these the Green Bay Packers some some great teams for there but people look down their nose at it in fact my father had originally gone to his father who was so wealthy was again the Attorney General and and very influential and sent me one to borrow the money he said I don't give any money to those amateurs pretending like they're pros so we had no choice she was the one in the end that if if it wasn't for Francis Upton if we look at the whole history Frances Upton Bert Bell later on inventing the pro football draft the Beano NFL because if if she hadn't convinced him she said why you wasting your time with the college football she said have you seen Red Grange come in you know that week nice man the he said she said he's seen the Bears play she was in New York time go to the Polo Grounds and you see the New York Giants she said why are you wasting those kinds of those rank amateurs so she finally took him to a pro game not that he didn't know about it but she's the one that was the influence for him to leave college football and get in the pros that's life yeah she's very prescient yeah that's a wonderful story now what about your career in football itself how you started I know you can tell us a little bit about the Boston Patriots being the manager in 72 72 what was that like well before I get to that let me get to the more bizarre stories okay so this is actually actually when I was born 1937 my first place to live was in the hotel that that's his father owned the Ritz Carlton on boats which is now pizza parlor and and they there I mean that was amazing all the amazing acts of around the country played there Bob Hope would come there Danny Thomas Cesar Romero I mean you named it well were you gonna take 33 football players and what are you gonna do with your kids so I ended up living in a hotel which I loved I mean to run the up you know run the elevators run while ago held everything and so we lived in a hotel and then we lived for a while in his father's mansion and then finally move from place to place to place in rented different places but you had to you know accommodate a place big enough for 33 football players and there are many places I believe that they were thrown out of because if you moved out to the main line and moved you know next to somebody it's very very rich and beautiful house and you have these players running out at all hours of the night and everything else like that it was a completely different story you know like the rock stars of later years yeah yeah yeah I mean it was an amazing existence all I can remember was and when you're a child you know I was never unhappy I thought Jesus next adventure we're leaving this house we're going to the next house it wasn't because we've chosen if somebody said you know to get the hell out of here I don't want these players in here in this neighborhood so we moved from place to place the place and finally he had the team to live you know the 30s and and part of that also was understanding what it was like to live in a communal experience that set my life on a certain way that you can't be selfish you have to have an attitude of being able to share you have to be able to live in a certain way remember a mother who had gone from a very middle-class family in New York to one of the voted one of the most beautiful woman in America she basically you know she said she stopped working today she would be still be working she was only in her 20s when she essentially retired but I often thought I wish you think oh sure I'm going from hanging out with Lindbergh and all these other people no I'm hey yeah with birth bell 33 football players so it's like a it was like I Love Lucy comedy it was like a comedy you would see today family people you never knew what was going to happen but they loved each other well they did they did and I and I most people would say Jesus what what type of life was that I'd see I that's why I think I can accept and face anything good or bad in life because you had to be able to adjust and you know I was a boy it was seven years old so all of that type of thing kind of said it in motion and then I went to my first a training camp outside of the Eagles in 1946 Chicago Bears they were the monsters of the Midway they were the Patriots of today that I mean they and remember this is before giant communications most year games some of them were televised until my father put in a national package but you get seventy eighty a hundred thousand people for a game I mean this this this was a this was a different world but but that kind of I said I kind of started to study players what did they do what how did they do it why are this formation seeing the league as as football began to develop Clark Shaughnessy was the first person that developed what you see today when when you see Julian Edelman if you've seen him then he would have been part of a backfill that had a fullback a left halfback at a right halfback one of the backs were the receivers that there were no flankers but Chuck Clark Shaughnessy I watched him on a blackboard one day as a kid say we're gonna keep the way described would I break off one running back and put him out there as a flanker and see if they cover him that's so I saw all of those beginnings and began to understand what made the game and then I kind of said this is something I think I want to do so that's that's where it started there and then progress through the Baltimore Colts which is one of the great experiences of my life and being in Baltimore in the 60s seeing a world with the great John Unitas in Gino Marchetti and and and Alan Ameche all these people who had returned from the war and knew what it was like to see death football and injuries wasn't anything to them so going through that and then eventually ending up that you said with the Patriots which was the good the bad and the ugly the good was I was the youngest general manager in history the bad was there were 33 owners the ugly was it got to be a pretty bad situation when I came here when I picked up the day I was announced to general manager pick up the paper and said Upton Bell comes to the BSP tree and I'm going I can't believe this and and eventually I said to them look it's it you don't want BS there and then you don't want BS standing for Billy Sullivan and I convinced the owners to change the name which it is today to the New England Patriots but it was a wild ride there were some great things that happen here I brought in a lot of people that eventually end up being general managers Jim Plunkett came to us who belongs in the Hall of Fame and you could see it was building it yes people only know it from 2000 to 2019 Tom Brady drank the whole thing but they don't know that other part the struggles the bizarreness the craziness the toilets not flushing the stadium not working all I want to forget that largest traffic chairman in history somebody I just wrote a thing for a new book on pro football on I call it the night the carburetors died where every car that tried to get into the opening night 1971 and August to see the Giants play the Patriots in an exhibition game and we barely got the goalposts in it's time for the game that's life bizarre now one of the most moving interesting stories in your book is about a trip south that you made and this there's a cultural aspect to this in addition to the football aspect tell us about that well it remains seared in my memory I called the chapter and I hope people get this book because it's just not a football book exact talked about it's really writes about the culture it's America time yes yeah and I had a chance to see America and still do but in nineteen in the 60s in those days unlike today where everything was computerized I was a young kid I was 24 years old and they put me in the scouting department and they said and they said here's how you learn here 50 brochures were rented you a car you'll leave Baltimore in January and please don't come back soon what the hell is this so there i Ross I know you you're somewhat scared I mean I'm sure III done a lot of driving but in those days unlike today where people drive and they fly everywhere I I had other than being on a train with my father going to the west coast in the 40s and seeing even even a Native Americans would dance on if he stopped in Albuquerque on your way to the coast which we did in 46 when you stopped there Native Americans would get up and do their dances on the train itself I mean it was like the Wild West which people would have you know hard to understanding but anyway that chapter on the south and I'm going to do more of it at some time my first stop I went Baltimore to Virginia the Shenandoah Valley and remember all this tripped them which again I'm going to do a second book on I hope there were no super highways you went through every little nook and cranny in every little tan you've got to know America Shenandoah Valley over into Georgia and then into Tennessee Mississippi Alabama and then you work your way out west through New Mexico Arizona then I drove all the way to the Oregon coast and back again every Collins every bozo and it's funny because every time I walk in again I look like I was 16 years old and I walk in and say coach I'm Upton Bell from the Baltimore Colts I'm here to take a look at your prospects and he'd say I took your I thought you the PR guys have worked here no no I'm really a scout but what happened was and and what is seared in my memory forever and applies to today is I had learned early on particularly in Baltimore because we did have african-american players even though they didn't come in until 1946 my father's first year when he insisted we have to the color line that this was before Jackie Robinson and many of the things I learned I will say to this audience today and around the country that in my opinion the african-american is still not and got the equal treatment that everybody else does I saw it up close and personal part of my job was to go in to every one of the african-american schools now in those days you know you had to go to Alabama because bear brines up on his Tower and Mississippi and all of these great schools and and white players I remember calling back to Baltimore and saying to Don Shula I said you know i i've got i've got all these schools I'm going to Georgia Georgia Tech Alabama Mississippi Vanderbilt three no players ever compares that Grambling Texas A&M or Texas Alcorn A&M Texas Southern Southern University Fisk I said the best the best players out here are all african-american and those days you said black players but I said are we kidding and because even in those days in the draft you can have a Jerry Rice who most people are familiar with today or Stanley Morgan or or any of the players that are playing with the pate Patriots and you'd say they belong in the first round and those days they go well you go Grambling fifth sixth seventh round most of them are in the Hall of Fame those players but what I saw were these isolated communities most of them far out of town to drive out to Grambling to drive through the Natchez Trace to Alcorn A&M to go to Baton Rouge a little bit different to Southern University it it really you understood that there were two worlds and as great as those players were there you want to far off that campus and you might not come back home and what I saw pulling into the little towns because I again I look so young and and the police would stop me everywhere now remember this was the time when when northern young people were getting on buses and going down to register voters that to me was a death sentence as we saw with what happened in Mississippi but I can remember every night 23 24 25 years old saying when I would go back to a hotel I'd say ORS or stopped in these towns by these police and they look at my license and I say you know officer our mother calls because I had this big white car that that was a dead giveaway it was a big Lincoln but I had to be in it to take this trip across the country and I'd say hey listen boy we're not buying that crap you're down here to register them and worse I said I'm really not I'm really a scout and sometimes I had to get them to take me to a school to have them identified that I am up to in Bell the Baltimore Colts but I can't tell you how many times that I went back to hotel and said next day I'm gonna find myself face down the Chattahoochee River it was scary maybe not quite as scary as now but I grew to have such a great appreciation of there there were two different worlds and I still believe that there is two different worlds it's gotten better but but when you see it like that and I can remember the reverse phears it was 19 I think 68 and it was Lou Brock Knight who had gone to Southern University so new university is in Baton Rouge LSU who was the big dog is right across the way was Lou Brock Knight Alcorn was playing they were playing not Grambling because there was a double-header they're playing solving you and so I had gone to a doubleheader in Mississippi and and of course could have gotten fired because I couldn't get any air any planes in the Baton Rouge after that game so I actually went out and hired a private pilot to fly me over the treetops from Jackson Mississippi to Baton Rouge it was not only scary but I'm saying you know this is going to be $1,000 I could be fired for doing this but anyway if we had him we rented a car and then we went to Southern University I was the only white person in the audience and it was the first time and people were looking at me there was a lot of anger at that time you know and and again I said I'm the scowl of the Colts was supposed to be in the press box so there was no press box she got in top of a car and looked down on the game there was a fistfight before the game there was all sorts again and I'm saying to him I think we better get out of here and I think it was the first time it hit home with me that what would happen if I were an african-american and an all-white crowd at that time well I got now to here alive I don't know that that changed my life as far as how I learned to really look at being the one person in a completely different society so that that again all those lessons I learned I not only learned football but but I learned about the politics of race the politics of life what can happen to you what happens if you end up on a back road somewhere that that chapter tells the story some very moving to quit don't quit things in there again I I look at life as being a lot of luck and whoo you know two incidents I was on my way to Selma now remember that in those days and again for people today that just you know get on their cell phones do their do their Twitter do their texting watch what's on television the radio and even in those days is your guide and so I always had the radio on for two reasons one if you're driving late at night because you go to a practice in the afternoon you write your reports and then you're on to the next city I always had a fear and a couple people did die of putting the radio on for fear of falling asleep at the wheel and remember you know you're not out here on the southeast expressway you know you're in Normandy roads you you're a Mormon Mississippi yeah and and there are no lights and and they they're never gonna find you if you go off the road but the other thing is I heard these reports on Selma Alabama in action I was heading that way because I was going through and heading on to Birmingham and so I pulled into a gas station and I tell the story in my book that I pull in their gas station and when you're young and naive I shouldn't have been and you see the restrooms White's there and there was another word for african-americans naively this guy comes out to pump the gas I said Jesus that's terrible I think I looked at me and he said I quote it in the book and he said if you don't get your ass out of here I've got a gun in there and I'll blow your brains out I didn't even wait I took off oh yeah the other part of that trip was I was going into Memphis for this for spring practice where you spend three or four days with the team to get a look at them it's like the Patriots you know practices now the OTAs and so I was in Memphis the third floor play I want to see so he's going to stay two or three days into the first day I said the coaching coach I want to come back you have two or three more prospects I want to take a look at and he looked at me and it's the only time in my life that I can remember where somebody said something to me I really pay attention he said go home I thought what the hell did I do here and the coach said Martin Luther King is coming in here today for the garbage man strike on Friday he said I think there'll be violence here I said go home so I went back to hotel I checked out Holiday Inn Memphis down a plane when I get off the plane I was looking up at the TV Martin Luther King assassinated that's the word Vice yeah yeah but that that's the world I lived in yeah that's the world and and that's why I say again today I'm not trying to preach I'm just saying we've got to find a way to do a better job of understanding what it's like to be a minority in this country so into that well you and Ron Borges have written a book that's a history as well as a book about football it's a book about our culture to talk about the country so and you know what I do want to say that Borges has done a great job with this and the reason I didn't start to out to pick the most popular person in town here I started out I wanted to pick somebody who understood the history because he's you know Ron's just about 70 but he understood all of this if I if I tried to get somebody today that'd do it they might be better right or whatever else it is but you have to understand the history you have to understand the time if you don't understand the history how are you ever going to tell it and that's that's what I looked at our context is important and there if there is a history in there and there are other besides the football part of the people I it really it really is a story the way it was how about a little about your media career who are some of your favorite interview subjects when you were in radio and TV well I actually it's interesting and it hasn't been announced yet and it will sometime in the future I'm going to have two major collections one on sports and and and one on over 500 people I've interviewed over my 40-year career and one again one of the things I learned from way way back as a child growing up that you've gotten into John is that you can't be afraid of life you cannot be afraid of taking chances three times out of four you're going to fail and I have I have no problem we're saying that that I have failed but the joy of taking the chance failing or or or not I would like to tell every young person out there don't sit on your Fanny in your parents basement playing with your computer get out and and look at life I have a certain period after being successful in sports doing calling all sports with Pablo bells sports beat the channel 38 with Dan Shaughnessy and and Lobell and Clark booth and and Joe Fitzgerald and and and many Bob Ryan one of the great writers of our time is I remember calling Lobell one day and saying in 1990 I'm leaving sports and he said to me you gonna be crazy said this is where you make the money I said but I'm going on to another life I never expect to make the money again but I'm not doing it for that I have never done anything for money people might find that hard to believe but I don't so I decided I wanted to do straight talk radio part of my reason was I'm sick and tired of calling athletes agents saying it's going to cost you this money to have this athlete on and and I said you know on and as much as I admire with athletes do I said why blow them up why not talk to you they're a lying politician or a statesman or somebody you don't have to pay and they get on tell you her story so I left in 1990 and and and went into a different life and and it really changed my life from 1990 to today I've interviewed over 500 great authors personalities 40 of them kill a surprise when there's ten of them Nobel Prize winners you name it and I've interview interviewed them and my show actually out at WT AG in Worcester two out of the three years was named the best show in New England not sports the best show and and the thing that I got out of it is a great piece of advice that people told me when you're interviewing somebody I interviewed George Herbert Walker Bush at the White House Bill Clinton Henry Kissinger you name it every every Madeleine Albright Hillary Clinton I can go on and on but this person said to me if you want to do a great interview know your material ask the question and get out of the way don't don't make don't make yourself the focal point of the interview but I will tell you a really interesting story of a person there's the only one that couldn't sign my book Stephen Hawking I thought I'd never be able to get an interview with him but I was able to do it and even though you know what the answers come out through a computer it was alone the most fascinating interviews I've ever done better Jeshua and so they liked it so much I did it when he was in London when he came here to Boston in 19 I want to say 93 and 94 and he was at the world war theater for a night on his book they took me in and introduced me to him I saw he didn't have the picture of it and here's the funny thing about it I walked out he's ver in person he's a was a very little man right in the chair and when I walked out I said he is one of the great geniuses next Einstein but I still wouldn't want to be him course yeah I still wouldn't want to be him story it is a sad story but Muhammad Ali without a doubt was the brightest person who never went to college could manipulate anybody was funny he gave me his private number and I used to call him every week at his training Keaveney it's good we do an hour for him just hello champ how's it going any brilliant person absolutely brilliant many of the people that I interviewed Peter Bogdanovich the movie director he wrote in a book for me that will be in a collection we did this whole interview on on what it was like to interview Orson Welles now again the audience today hopefully around the country will look up who Orson Welles was who was one of the most brilliant actors a lot of people Citizen Kane still concerns to his his talk whatever it's like to deal with this crazy man it's classic radio and that's what you want Bill Clinton interviews him when he was in all the trouble in New Hampshire the first time around and remember at the end of the interview I walked into my producer and I said I don't care who he had sex with what he did he's going to be President so they're just some of the of the many that I really interviewed well in in our book 10 a good company in which you have an essay something you wrote at the very end is something that will always stay with me and it's kind of the way you've lived your life and you said when I get to the gate if it's closed I will climb over it yeah and that's the way you've lived your life yeah and and it's all in there it's a great read and you've had a story it's wonderful career and no wait the people should yep there you you really would out you know I'm not going to get rich with with this but that isn't the reason that I wrote it but I would like enough people it's done so well that they've kept it out there even for two years there there are so many other things I know we don't have all the time but I will tell a couple of stories about my mother she was again I I love a to parents who are like your heads on a swivel what you know when you go to the dinner table they talk about the Kennedy going the dinner table and all the things they learn why could here politics I could his showbiz naked area but you're like this what's he but he say she was and the movie was just out yesterday again love me or leave me James Cagney I'm and the Ruth etting and she and Ruth etting were friends and they were roommates when they were on on the road and particularly in Chicago and Ruth etting says to her one night most the GIMP Snider who she married for a while is play by Jimmy Cagney in the movie she said she said we've been invited by machine-gun Ned McGurn and and Moe to have dinner without Capone my mother and naive heard of his name but she said she know really who Capone was so they go to this restaurant and she walks in and she ends up sitting across from Capone and she's noticed all all of the of schürrle gangsters with the backs against the wall and all of the show business people and then their their backs are to the door and she says holy Smokies go Oh mr. Capone why aren't we sitting next to each other and he just an eddying you know kicks her and says because we're live bait I mean if that's what that's that's so many of the things that happen but again it's you can't because of today where everybody's on everybody's talk show and they sit on the couch and they said say most of them are very boring stories but they're promoting their product I said yeah those were real people they they weren't doing shows – you know pitch their stuff they they they lived among each other final story of that nineteen when the Lindbergh baby was stolen my a group came to my father and said Al Capone was in prison in Philadelphia at the time federal prison not far actually walk down and so on and I said Bert can you get in to see Capone and see if it was an underworld job he went in to see Capone this is how quickly forget Twitter yeah within 24 hours Capone got the word back to them not an underworld job look somewhere else Wow yeah very well finally Upton what advice do you have for young people and whatever pursuit they choose but what what advice in general would you give young people today in this very different world well since I'm a very young person I've tried to maintain a youthful outlook on life first thing I would tell them is you really turn the cellphone's off for a while and learnt really learn how to read ah number one number two learn how to write if you can write you can get a job anywhere but but also keep you've you've got to be interested in learning about the past I can't tell you how many people are running to and I'm not talking down to anybody is that that the more you read I don't care what it is you read reading will enable you to not only bring greater enjoyment to your life but give you the ability to converse when you go in for an interview whatever you do also learn to write I don't care whether you're a good writer or a bad writer reading and writing communicating but not through a text not through the you know the social media I mean I see these players get on day you know and the worst thing that's happened in sports Twitter yes Twitter not just school yes and and that and that's why by the way I have such great admiration for the present Boston Bruins and what they're doing I mean we're great comeback and playoffs they're one of the last sports left they don't get on they don't do Twitter they're very much within themselves their team is very very important to them they pay a very high price for the pain that they accept as you know Zdeno Chara broken jaw who the hell place or the broken jaw you wouldn't play it in football so there there is the whole idea that you need time and and you know I walk in the forest a mountain climb we do all these things please he used to be a day when somebody was not saying you know what I'll be down the mountain a very very shortly order me the small pizza please but read write take time to turn off the phone I have a phone I have all that stuff take that time for yourself but also nobody's going to ask you I always tell people is nobody's going to ask you on your deathbed how much money you made how many tweets you put out there you know what you're going to ask yourself did I do what I want to do in life and I guarantee you a lot of people won't do what they should have done in life I had no regrets yeah now more than ever thank you up done this has been terrific great thank you for all right John and whitening us that's right yes the gates closing but I won't worry about that because I'll climb it and that's the way you've lived your life that much tremendous a metaphor climb that gate put yourself out there what do you got to lose just another bad joke

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